Hello everyone. I recently got a copy of GTA4 Complete Edition for my PS3 and wish to talk about it. I haven't played the game since it first came out. I remember me and my dad messing around with it when it first came out. Good times.
For those who don't want to read this and want a TLDR: I enjoyed GTA4 and TBoGT DLC. Didn't enjoy TLaD DLC as much. Liked the story, world and details. Felt the lack of checkpoints and rigid mission design hurt the game. Still would recommend the game(s).
Now for the super long review:
When I first booted up the game now and started playing the first mission, what immediately struck me (aside from how despite the kinda rough looking graphics but really solid animations and details) was how whack the driving physics are. GTA4, compared to its successors and predecessors, is an outlier by having really heavy and grounded driving physics. Cars take a while to get up to top speed, understeer hard, and can be a challenge to weave in between traffic. I remember in the starting area, intentionally making a super slow left turn at an intersection in the starter car and only barely making it and thinking "holy smokes. I feel driving IRL is easier lmao". I remember there was even a Reddit Post a while back that compared GTA4's Driving to an equivalent car in Assetto Corsa and the Sim Racer handled the car better and easier lol. GTA4 cars lack downforce and have way bouncier suspensions.
Still, I can see the appeal of this made by GTA4 fans and even agree with some of them. The heavier physics mean driving from point A to B is actually kinda challenging. In GTAV for example, you have super arcade-y driving physics where even large trucks can turn on a dime and weave through traffic. GTA4's approach mean something simple like going to a place weaving through traffic can be rewarding because of the effort and skill required to pull it off. Moreover, cars seem to transfer more momentum which makes collisions more impactful (as well as individual vehicles feeling more distinct to drive). Crashing a large van into a smaller car and seeing the damage and crumpled cars looks gnarly. More intense damage can even start affecting the car by misalligning tires and changing its shape. I recall the PS3 version of GTAV having somewhat similar car deformation but not the PS4 version in order to accommodate car interiors.
In fact, GTA4 has some of the most impressive dynamic animations and ragdoll physics and details I've ever seen in games. You slightly bonk or get bonked by a car and the NPC will reach out and properly balance themselves in response. Shooting enemies has them tumble and react in more elaborate ways. Even fires and explosions seem more punchy and believable compared to other games (especially car fires).
But back to the driving physics, I won't deny it isn't satisfying at times. I remember one of the later optional Most Wanted Missions where I had to catch a fleeing car where my car's tires got blown out and I had to drive backwards, do a perfect J-turn and resume shooting at the car. It felt really cool. Especially as I could see my target car swerving with busted tires. There was this sense of "we're both playing with the same rules yet I outperformed you".
But at the same time, even with the eventual fun and my improvements, it never felt "fully comfortable" to me. It's hard to describe. Imagine you're playing Sonic The Hedgehog 1 and you're in Marble Zone after Green Hill Zone. Even though you can clear the zone pretty fast now, it doesn't feel great to actually play through since it lacks the open ended speed of other Sonic 1 levels. That's kinda how I felt driving in GTA4. I never felt "one with the controls" as it were.
I'm reminded of a video by YouTuber Whitelight who talked about how the map in a driving game should match the driving physics for the best possible results between game feel and gameplay. Need for Speed Hot Pursuit 2010 had really heavy highway based driving physics because the game focussed on highway driving. Cars took a while to get up to top speed and turning was more challenging but it fit what the game was going for. Meanwhile, 2012's Need for Speed Most Wanted kept the same driving physics from Hot Pursuit but set the game in a city resulting in a more frustrating experience. City based driving games typically require more arcade-y physics to compensate for the more narrow grid-like layouts. That's why games like GTAV, Saints Row and Simpsons Hit and Run have the driving physics that they do. They expect the player to be crashing out, getting into pursuits, racing, driving through dense and narrow city streets, doing drive-bys etc as well as frequently swapping cars. So the physics are designed to compliment that and make it more fun to do.
I suspect this is why GTA4's driving physics never fully clicked for me and why I began to prefer using Taxis more to fast travel as the game went on. The map seems designed for a more arcade-y style but the driving is more realistic leading to a bit of a mismatch. And I imagine the case for all the people that complained about GTA4's driving over the years. Moreover, it's odd because this is the only core gameplay system in GTA4 that is so demanding and "realistic". Gunplay, melee combat, stealth etc, don't require the player to account for bullet drop, heavy recoil, proper firing techniques and precision etc. I would have preferred if GTA4 picked a lane. Be that more grounded almost sim-like GTA where driving and combat required a more thoughtful approach, or be like other GTAs and be more arcade-y. In any case, I do feel the best option for a GTA6 would be GTAV's general model with some of the aspects from GTA4. Give me more distinct vehicle handling with more deformation and more apparent momentum.
I will note that gunplay in GTA4 is probably my favourite iteration of gunplay in any of Rockstar's open world games. In GTAV and RDR2, the gunplay there was built almost entirely around the auto-aim system. Hold L2 to lock onto the target, flick the right stick up slightly and press R2 to get easy headshots. Even Body shots were also quite good as the auto-aim was too helpful. It was too easy to "autopilot" my way through shootouts.
GTA4, despite using an auto-aim system that would be the basis of future Rockstar open world games, makes a few smart decisions with it. For one, fully holding L2 to use the auto-aim has it target the body of the target. Firing at a target continuously increases the reticule and makes shots less accurate. Moreover, if a target takes cover, the auto-aim will still target their covered body. Enemies in cover like to pop in and out quickly in cover. Your character takes a second to pop out of cover so trying to auto-aim fire a covered enemy can waste more time and leave you exposed.
If you half press L2, you enter a free aim that with no aim-assist lets you aim more precisely. So you can use this to manually target heads and limbs sticking out of cover. As I played the game, I alternated between the 3 kinds of shooting depending on the situation, Just R2 for blind/hip fire, full press L2 for auto-aim shots, and half-press L2s for precise headshots from behind cover. While not the most fun 3rd person shooter gameplay in the world, I was more entertained than I was in GTAV and RDR2's shootouts. I guess it also feels more in-line with my character since as I am being more dexterous with half holding L2, they are aiming more precisely?
The controls are a bit finicky here. I like that you have a dedicated crouch button with L3 and a dedicated "take cover" button with R1 that even lets you do stuff like cover change. But sometimes, pressing R1 to leave cover was inconsistent or had my character take cover on something else. The weapon switching controls are a weird hybrid between the Dpad switching of prior GTAs and the weapon wheel of GTAV/RDR2. In GTA4, You can use the Dpad to cycle between all your weapons. But you can also use L1+ Dpad to quick select between a pistol, sidearm, grenade and rifle. This is an area GTAV and RDR2 improved on. Just having a weapon wheel with L1 lets you more precisely pick the weapon you want, have even more equipment, and frees up the regular Dpad. My other main gripe with the controls is the "mashing X to sprint" that's been a thing in every Rockstar open world game. I really dislike this. It feels annoying and tires me out. Let me just hold X or press L3 to sprint like every other game 😤.
As I played GTA4 more, I was reminded of a review of the game by Shamus Young and NakeyJakey. They both pointed out how Rockstar's rather rigid and linear mission design hindered their games. GTA4 is a really interesting sandbox with a ton of cool mechanics. You can pick up and throw bricks and bottles. But there's only one early game mission that requires you do it. After that, bottles and bricks never come up again. You can find them in the open world but there's no place to use them. You can pull over cars by using the sirens of a stolen police car. There's a mission that teaches you this mechanic to pull over vans. But no future missions where you have to stop a fleeing vehicle let you use this mechanic.
The game has a pretty cool melee system with disarms and counters and pushes that can play nicely with stealth. But after the early game, melee is useless because combat encounters require guns and cars. There's a mission with Packie where Niko has to climb around a building to get the drop on enemies but combat arenas no longer feature ledges you can use to climb around. There's a mission in the L&D DLC where you can call your allies to cover the rear entrance of a house while you can throw a grenade through a window to flush the target out. But no other strongholds ever incorporate this mechanic.
Aside from hurting replayability, the game's rigid adherence to a strict order during missions can also make the game frustrating in some places. Missions don't have checkpoints. I remember there was mission for Ray Pegerino where you escort him to a meet up with a pretty long drive, the meet up goes wrong, you need to shoot your way through a lot of heavily armed guards to get to Rey, then get in a car and help him chase down another car with some diamonds he wants. The game paints the target car as red and instructs you to take out like you do in other missions. I began firing at it with my Uzi. When the car blew up, I got a mission fail because it also destroyed the diamonds.
The "correct" play was to simply follow the car until it crashed, the occupants ejected out so I could shoot them, then nab the diamonds, get back in Rey's car and drive him home. I dislike this because there are chasing missions where you have to shoot the car to damage it to get the occupants to bail so you can finish them off. But there are also missions where you have to follow the target car or bike to a certain point but they are immune to your bullets. And there are missions where you have to follow the target car or bike to a certain point but they aren't immune to your bullets. If you choose wrong, you risk failing the mission and have to restart from the very beginning. GTA4 offers a "quick restart" option to let you instantly restart the mission but it doesn't refund any of the armour or ammo you lost during the mission. You could load a save to get your equipment back but then you have to drive all the way back to the mission start point.
This Rey Pegerino mission stood out to me in a few ways. I had already failed the mission once before by not noticing an enemy and getting shredded. On my second attempt, I played it all the way to the chase and failed by blowing up the target car because I had no way of knowing I was just supposed to follow it. On my 3rd attempt, I got impatient and tried rushing through it and died again. On my 4th attempt, I took the time to go buy ammo and armour, then I played it nice and slowly and got it. I felt more annoyed after this mission. Repeating the same drives, listening to 2-3 different versions of the same dialogue but then the same dialogue, redoing the same shootouts.
GTA4's lack of checkpoints and rigid mission design, aside from being frustrating and annoying, also discourage replayability and experimentation. I remember in GTAV, during even simple missions like "The Ballad of Rocco", I was exploring around the building, looking for other ways up and not minding that I got a mission fail because the mission had pretty generous checkpoints. Even during firefights, I found myself playing more aggressively and getting closer with enemies or using explosives. In GTA4, I found that the more I played, the more cautious I became. I started maining the sniper rifle and AK47 as their longer range let me deal with many enemy areas safer from a distance. I started using Taxis to skip the drives even during missions. Even GTA4 seems to recognize this. The last story mission actually has a checkpoint in it after the long drive. The DLCs even include regular checkpoints in missions (although they don't refund any spent resources but it's still a huge boon).
I will talk now a bit about the PS3 version I played. I've heard that the best version of the game might be the Xbox 360 version. The PC version has issues with performance and stability, especially at higher FPS, as well as having some songs and licensed content removed. I played the physical Complete Edition Greatest Hits Disc at version 1.06. This version has..... some issues. The framerate is especially rough especially when you start driving or getting into large firefights with explosions. It feels like it drops below 20 FPS when you hit max speed in cars or get multiple explosions. I also had around 3 instances of hitting an invisible building, pole and car that then loaded in a few seconds later. When flying in a helicopter, some buildings remained with their low quality textures for a really long time (more of a funny thing when that happened lol).
I didn't encounter too many major bugs/glitches except for the mission Paper Trail which gave me a fear of helicopters.
With this mission, I noted that when I received the Phone call for it from U L Paper, there was no audio from the phone call that starts the mission. I went to the helicopter and again, no dialogue. I followed the target helicopter and even the radio was silent. When I was right above the water right before the target helicopter escapes, Little Jacob pops out, fired one RPG, missed, and I got the mission fail for letting the target escape. I retried the mission and the same thing happened. I figured I had to line up with the target perfectly so Little Jacob's 1 shot would hit. This was an oddly challenging and strict mission.
That's how I spent the next 2 hours. Repeating this mission over and over again. Trying different strats and flying more perfectly. I put on the Bright Sessions Podcast to make the attempts more bearable. I thought to myself "I would kill to have Big Smoke from GTASA here with me instead of Little Jacob. Even he was a better shot". I looked up walkthroughs and forum posts and nothing helped. They all said "the mission is fine, just fly slightly ahead and to the side and you'll get it first try. Just get good". I was bamboozled. What's going on? Shouldn't this be the most frustrating mission in GTA history? Why is nobody complaining about this? Worse was that I couldn't even go do other missions since the Call to Start this mission is mandatory. I noted that when I tried quitting out.
Finally, I found a GameFAQs post that noted the audio issues for this mission and recommended NOT to load your save. It advised shutting down your system and booting it up entirely. I did so and all of a sudden, the mission had proper dialogue and Little Jacob started firing as soon as we crossed the water rather at the last possible second. He fired 3 rockets and the 3rd one got the target helicopter. Words could not describe how overjoyed I was. I was not looking forward to having to restart my PS3 every time I wanted to retry this mission. Reading up further, this bug seems to be caused by reloading your saves frequently and saving over that. Something I was doing a lot of since I was gunning for the trophy to beat the game under 30 hours 😬. Fortunately, the game never did anything like this again but I can't say I wasn't very worried.
Moving on from all that and talking more positively about the world, GTA4 may be 16 years old, but it still feels like a big budget game. You can feel it in all the random vocal barks NPCs have as you walk the streets. How you can have conversations with Taxi Drivers. The wealth of dialogue during hangouts. How extensive the in-game internet and radio are. I remember reading that Rockstar did research on the demographics and car dealerships in IRL New York so in-game locations had an accurate depiction of people and their cars. Which is why Sports cars are rare in the game compared to GTAV. You can walk into restaurants and order food and eat it.
Moreover, playing the game in 2025, it feels like such a time capsule of 2008. From the culture, the advertisements, how its in-game internet depicts chat rooms and websites, the phones you use, the radio having conservative pundits talk about hot button 2008 issues like terrorism, gay rights and immigration etc. You know how like, Assassin's Creed 2 was made to replicate 1450's Florence in intricate detail as a historical piece? GTA4 feels like that but for 2008 New York. Apparently TV Tropes calls this an "Unintentional Period Piece" where "Many works that are intended to be "contemporary" end up displaying so many cultural quirks that later audiences mistake it for a deliberate exaggeration of the era by a work made much later". I feel that describes GTA4 well.
Part of that is the usual satire GTA games are known for but it has more of a narrative purpose as well. You play as Niko Belic, an immigrant who is new to Liberty City. The game was designed to highlight how "over the top" this place is for a newcomer. Niko even comments on the shallow materialism of the Liberty City residents. So the satire here plays double duty in putting you in Niko's shoes by seeing how weird yet believable this place is.
I see a lot of comments from people hoping GTA6 takes after GTA4's darker and more grounded tone compared to GTAV. But I don't think that will be the case. Recall that GTA games are inspired by the popular depictions, movies and cultures of the setting. GTA3 was rather dark and serious compared to GTA Vice City because a lot of stereotypical crime and action films depict New York as this gritty dark place. Makes sense that the 2 sorta modern GTA games set in New York would turn that grit up to 11. Conversely, GTA Vice City is a lot more wacky than GTA3 since Miami has that wacky depiction in popular media. GTAV is pretty wacky because the popular stereotype of Los Angeles is of this materialistic, celebrity obsessed place.
I suppose the point I am making is that GTA4's tone and world feel tailor made to a GTA game set in New York. I can't imagine a GTA game set in New York that would capture the same vibe if it was wacky like VC or V. Nor can I imagine GTA4's tone working well for GTAV or 6. It's the same way why Watch Dogs 1's gritty tone suits a more noire inspired game set in Chicago while Watch Dogs 2's more wacky tone fits a game set in a very 2016 Summer and techy San Francisco.
In terms of graphics and animations, GTA4 is surprisingly good. The mocap and performances during cutscenes is solid and you can really see emotions' on characters' faces as they talk. People move and act in lifelike ways. A lot of models are distinct in appearance and voice. The game's production values elevate it.
I will complain there are a few aspects of GTA4's presentation I am not fond off. For one, a lot of cutscenes start and end with a "fade to black" before resuming gameplay or the next sequence which sorta kills my flow. Not as much of a problem in GTA3-SA since the version I now play on modern hardware load so fast that the fades are too brief to be noticeable. An GTAV rarely has fades like this. But in 4, the occasional 10-20 seconds load in place of cutscene transitions can be jarring and take me out of the experience. I suppose that is a technical issue and can't really be helped.
Another more severe issue is the lack of an OST. GTAV had a full on OST that played non-diegetic music during certain sequences which elevated the set pieces. For example, there are unique and subtle background tracks that play when you are doing the Jewellery Store Heist Loud or Smart. The Smart piece sounds a lot more "mischievous" for lack of a better phrase which really adds to the act of sneaking to throw in a sleep grenade. GTA4, in contrast, is an awkwardly silent game when you are out of your car. A lot of cutscenes, shootouts, sneaking sections etc feel less impactful without accompanying music. This was also an issue in previous GTA games but feels more noticeable here given GTA4's otherwise stellar presentation.
This is also probably just me, but I kinda dislike how the radio host, Lazlow is depicted in this game. One of the things I liked about GTA3's radio was that Lazlow was kinda the "straight man" to the wackiness on the radio. Such as him arguing against the people that were blindly against phone use and the like. It acted as some nice contrast and grounded the game, making it feel oddly more real in a sense. GTA4 makes him just as wacky, unhinged and twisted as any typical satirical GTA character. I suppose you could argue that Niko, Johnny and Luis are already the "straight men" here but they don't necessarily care about the wider world or aspects of Liberty City that don't immediately concern them. Having a "straight man" Lazlow trying to work through the wacky world of GTA4's radio would serve as some nice contrast. Plus, there's already a wacky and exaggerated conservative radio show so you'd have more variety. Have Lazlow be something of a reverse-JJJ where he is the rational one dealing with wacky and conspiratorial figures.
Moving on from this, I found myself entertained by GTA4 and its DLC's stories. The ways they interspersed, explored the criminal underworld of the setting, the themes of revenge. It's good stuff.
I do wonder if the game went a bit too far in accommodating its story by sacrificing its gameplay. I am not taking about Niko, Johnny or Luis going on shooting sprees when they are supposed to be more chill. I am talking more about certain gameplay limitations.
For example, Niko barely has any customization options (either for him or his vehicles). There are no property you can purchase. Meaning by the halfway point, I had 700k+ and nothing to spend it on. I could easily top out my supplies every mission and burn them. Johnny in the L&D DLC can't even change his clothes and most of his missions require you drive a motorcycle. Narriatively, this makes sense. Niko doesn't care about luxury, fashion, flexing or splurging. He sees money as a means to an end at best. He is consumed by his quest for revenge. He doesn't even have a Visa or Green Card so he can't exactly buy property. Johnny is loyal to his fellow bikers and is a ride-or-die biker. He's not going to change his style or suddenly drive cars casually.
Some of this could actually be the result of budget and deadlines that happens to be explainable by the story. But still, I remember reading reviews and Gameasutra posts from 2009 about how “GTA4’s story is the wrong fit for a GTA game”. I wouldn’t go that far (except for L&D). But when GTA4 gets its inevitable re-release in 2028 or something, I feel its reputation will be a lot more mixed. You see a lot of YouTube videos and comments showing how GTA4 is better than GTAV by highlighting its physics, environmental interactions, animations etc. But when fans of GTAV (and likely GTA6) play a remaster of a GTA game with minimal player customization, zero car customization, no property or planes, and a much smaller map with a different driving experience than what most players expect, I expect the current public sentiment on GTA4 to shift. GTA4’s current reputation benefited from coming out when it did and being relatively inaccessible on modern hardware.
I do wish to speak about GTA4’s DLC. I was curious to check it out after years of people praising it. To put my biases upfront on the table, I am someone who is skeptical about any game’s Singleplayer DLC as I feel their structure can limit how integrated they can be with the base game. Paid Singleplayer DLC, by its nature, meant to be fragmented. The base game has to accommodate players who both have and don’t have the DLC. As a result, games are pressured to be designed in such a way where the DLC is somewhat disconnected from the base game so content from one may be limited in the other. There are exceptions to this. Cyberpunk 2077 and the Dark Souls games do a great job in structuring the DLC as part of the main game so you won’t even notice you’re playing DLC content or using DLC items in the base game. Something like Skyrim and Borderlands may have DLC that is disconnected from their main plots but act as expansive side areas and content that work well to compliment your playthrough to the point it’s hard to imagine the game without it.
On the other hand, you have Spider-Man 2018 where the DLC is accessed from a separate menu that includes its own exclusive progression and activities. The crimes you stop in the DLC don’t count towards crimes you stop in the base game. The exclusive bomb defusal activities don’t appear in the base game despite how much variety that could add. As a result, you have no reason to enter the DLC after you complete them. This is an example of what I mean when I say that paid singleplayer DLC can feel fragmented. If SM2018 came out in 2019 and had this DLC as part of the base game, then the content could have been integrated much better with the base game (see RDR2’s epilogue).
GTA4’s DLC unfortunately feels closer to the Spider-Man 2018 model. The DLCs are launched as separate games when you first launch the application similar to PS3 HD Collections. Their improvements and additions don’t carry over to each other or to the base game. For example, L&D’s automatic pistol, striker shotgun, grenade launcher or gang activities or even checkpoints don’t appear in base GTA4. TBoGT’s mission scoring and replay system and nightclubs don’t appear in either L&D or the base game. Conversely, content and progression from the base game like pigeons, strangers, Street Races, Most Wanted pursuits, Stunt Races/Flight Challenges, Assassination missions etc aren’t doable in the DLCs. You even have to make a completely separate save for the DLCs that shares slots with the base game. Something I learned the hard way when I accidentally overwrote my GTA4 base game save with a L&D save 😢.
This structure already caps a lot of the value of the DLCs. Let’s say you get tired of doing some of Johnny’s races and want to take a break doing Niko or Luis’ content. You can’t without exiting the application altogether. Once you complete a DLC, you have very little reason to return to it as the base game has more content. This is why I feel GTAV’s multiple protagonists worked better at least from an overall gameplay perspective. You had 3 characters sharing the same playthrough, world and general set of activities and you could quickly switch between them to access their exclusive content. Conversely, even though games like GTA LCS and VCS feel like expansion packs/remixes of GTA3 and VC but on the PSP, since they are full games that released after GTA3 and VC, they have content comparable to full games since they are meant to be entire standalone games rather than add-ons to already complete games.
I’m willing to acknowledge perhaps there were technical limitations, budget or time issues holding the GTA4 Complete experience back from a more integrated experience. After all, it was 2008 on 7th gen consoles. Even having DLC like this in the first place was likely an achievement. But in any case, it would help explain why the DLC underperformed. You’re not paying to add more content to the base game, you’re paying for a smaller standalone experience with a fraction of the content. That’s a tough sell.
As for the DLCs themselves, looking at them as standalone experiences, I was a lot more mixed on TL&D. The early game was a bit dull with how you have to slowly follow your fellow Bikers in formation as you drive between locations. You know that one meme that’s like “I hate following missions where the guy you’re following moves slower than your run speed but faster than your walk speed”? That's how I felt during a lot of these missions. Sometimes, the mission would have the other bikers say “let’s race” so you can now zoom ahead to the destination. I found that a lot more entertaining. I wish I could trigger that manually. I play GTA games to zoom fast, not slowly follow NPCs.
The game tries to have some gameplay benefits to sticking in the correct biker formation by recovering your and your bike’s health and ammo and playing more dialogue but I never found these worthwhile. The game also tries to have something of a pseudo “Assassin’s Creed Brotherhood” system where your fellow bikers ride you, gain stats by doing missions with you, can die and need to be replaced etc. the idea is cool but I didn’t notice much benefits with the fodder recruits. The named crew members, Terry and Clay, can’t die and help in drawing fire just as well as new recruits. Plus they have unique set pieces and interactions in certain missions when you call them. I notice the game keeps reminding you to use them with text messages in missions. I suspect this is because playtesters forgot about them and just played these missions solo.
I did use my fellow bikers more for discounted ammo restocks and delivering me bikes (which only worked around 60% of the time when I called them). But ultimately, I think the gameplay is too limited here to really feel a bond between brothers. The game even has a wall in your safehouse that memorializes fallen comrades that I barely noticed until way after the fact.
I feel the bigger issue with the game is the player character. Johnny Klebitz is part of a motorcycle gang. A lot of the main and side missions require you to be on a bike. If you hop off your bike to steal a car, the game prompts you to return to your bike. Some side races and gang hideouts won’t even start unless you are on a bike. And some won’t spawn one for you. I remember wanting to do all the bike races in this game. But a lot of the time, when I arrived on my car and phoned Terry to deliver me a bike, he was unavailable. Requiring me to taxi back to the main safehouse, grab a bike and drive back to the race.
I question the value in making a Grand Theft Auto DLC that discourages the player from committing Grand Theft Auto. TL&D wants 90% of your vehicle use to be 1 of 4 kinds of bikes. I feel the appeal of a GTA game is the variety in scenarios, activities, vehicles and gameplay. The story and new weapons in TL&D are kinda cool. But the DLC as a whole wasn’t very fun to play. I don’t think I’ll be replaying this one.
TBoGT, on the other hand, was a lot more enjoyable. Maybe it was the lull after TLaD but I was vibing hard with TBoGT. I love the setup and premise. I like how the colours are shifted to be more colourful to represent Luis as a nightclub bouncer (though the colours can be hard to see on the full map. Dark Green for certain waypoints instead of Niko's bright pink is a bit hard to see exactly for me. The game uses both pink for main mission waypoints and red for enemies so it was hard at times to be 100% certain what I was walking into).
I really like the character of Luis and his story. Him juggling his life with his job and mom and estranged siblings plus His friends and their interactions felt genuine and relatable. Him being pulled apart by working with Tony and all the trouble it's causing him. I was invested. I also felt the crossover missions with Niko and Johnny's story were a lot more creative here with Luis using Yusuf's helicopter and tools rather than just doing another on-foot mission.
TBoGT also introduces more varied side missions than TLaD. You have more varied drug war missions, a fight club, base jumping and triathlons. This feels closer to a full fledged GTA game compared to TLaD (especially since being a Nightclub bouncer doesn't constrain the kinds of missions Luis can do). Like, if I had to guess, TBoGT, as a standalone game, feels like it has more fun content and variety and improved gameplay and controls than GTA3,VC and CT combined. While also feeling like it has about 40% the content of base GTA4.
TBoGT also makes some nice improvements and additions. Missions can be replayed and have a scoring system/optional objectives encouraging you to do better (although the oddly precise objectives in some missions plus the lack of manual checkpoints in missions hurts this). Side missions like base jumping no longer require you bring in your own supplies (I hated this in TLaD). So you just get given a parachute instead of being blocked off until you bring your own.
I do have some complaints but most of them stem from TBoGT being a DLC. A DLC means it can't have the 90+ main missions that Niko had in the base game. Instead only having 26-ish. So the game has to speedrun a bit through Luis' family and friends' lives and how much danger he and his family is in now thanks to working with Tony. So around mission 24-ish when the Russian mafia tells Luis he has to kill Tony or everyone he knows and loves will also die, it lacks impact because it feels like we've skipped a few steps and are ignoring "show don't tell" because the DLC doesn't have the means to show that danger.
Like in GTAV, there is a mission where Micheal's family are attacked by Merriweather. Highlighting the danger that the villains pose to Micheal. Which is why the Deathwish mission feels so climactic. You get that payback. Imagine instead of that mission, Devin Weston just told Micheal his family could be in danger if he didn't work for him. Wouldn't feel as intense. That's what TBoGT does.
My other complaint is that TBoGT's additions also are isolated to just the DLC. They don't get retroactively added to the base game. So even though TBoGT adds parachutes, base jumping, drug wars, new weapon types and triathlons, you can't do them unless you are playing TBoGT. Conversely, you can't do the regular races, assassinations and Most Wanted missions from the base game in TBoGT. In addition, TBoGT inherits the same flaws GTA4's base game still has in the more rigid mission design and limited opportunities to use GTA4's bevy of mechanics in interesting ways.
I suppose you could argue that it doesn't make sense for Niko to do triathlons or base jumping or for Luis to do Assassinations. But I feel it's better to have that inconsistency than have a TLaD situation where the game is less interesting as a whole because so many open world activities are sacrificed for the sake of the story. I feel most players would be glad at having more varied gameplay.
Speaking of the side activities, I will also complain about the Drug Wars Side missions since you have to do 25 of them to get a trophy (although the game gives you more rewards up to 50). These work a bit like Radiant Quests in Skyrim. There's a couple "Mission Start points" all over the map. You go to one and it starts a random Drug Wars missions with different types such as "Hijack" (there's a stationary drug loaded vehicle, your friends remark how this will be easy, as soon as you steal it, it gives you a 2 star wanted level. You have to escape it and deliver the vehicle to a drop off point), "Convoy" (there's a moving car or boat. Get close to it and have your friends kill everyone so you can steal it and drop it off), "Stickup" (go to a spot and get in a firefight with a large number of gangsters. One of them has the drugs you need. Kill him to drop it and retrieve it and then drop it off), and "Stash" (there's a bag of drugs guarded by gangsters. Basically Stickup but you don't need to kill people until one drops it).
These missions can be kinda fun and pay out around $9000 per mission so can be a good way to grind money. Some scenarios can be kinda cool letting you steal helicopters. The dialogue can also be interesting and I had some fun moments seeing my friends draw aggro and die to give me a chance to escape with the drugs. The issue is if you are gunning for completionism. These missions start repeating quickly as there are only around 10 variations (being generous). You'll hear the same dialogue and see the same scenarios over and over again if you aim for the 25 for the trophy like me. And there are rewards for doing 50! Some of the Stickups and Stashes are also really challenging with gangsters with AK47s that can chase you down, shred your health and incapacitate your friends. I think I did around 32 of these missions in order to complete the 25 I needed for the trophy.
The structure of these missions is also rough. The game treats these like proper missions, but doesn't do checkpoints. So if you mess up, you gotta go to a new Mission Start point and load a new Drug Wars Mission. I think this is an area Ubisoft's games do better. The Far Cry and Assassin's Creed games of the time have dynamic outposts you can just casually enter and clear without needing to launch a dedicated mission for them. If TBoGT structured Drug Wars as "hotspots" you can casually enter when off mission and bring backup, I feel they'd be more fun as activities you can do as you explore the open world.
The other side missions fare a lot better. For Base Jumping, you only need 15 for the trophy so they don't get as repetitive. They're also "static quests" as opposed to "Radiant Style quests" and offer some nice parachuting challenges as you glide through checkpoints and land on vehicles. I found these more enjoyable. Fight Club gets a bit more tedious since it's the same fights over and over again.
In closing, I really enjoyed my time with GTA4. I had some frustrating moments. The lack of checkpoints, rigid mission design and some control oddities mean I probably won't be doing replays of this game anytime soon. But I can see the appeal of GTA4. The story, world, tone and vibe of the game still stands strong. I'd recommend GTA4 and TBoGT. But you can skip TLaD and watch its cutscenes on YouTube. You won't miss as much. Still, I do hope this game gets a remaster so people can actually and comfortably play it in the modern day because despite everything, the game is a work of art.
